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Alex Scarrow
Ape
969 Posts |
 Posted - 26 July 2006 : 6:35:01 PM
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Okay...I'm liking Drosdelnoch's already. I like the idea of removing all perks/incentive to cream profit out of being an MP. I like that a lot.
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Ankhsy
Homosapien
United Kingdom
7087 Posts |
Posted - 29 July 2006 : 4:48:41 PM
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I completely agree with that. The abuse of MPs perks is disgraceful! While I believe that MPs have to be paid well to entice good calibre candidates, to a large extent there must me a primary willingness to do it for the public good and not for the financial profits involved. Politics should not be a for-profit enterprise.
"It's hard to work in a group when you're omniscient."
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Edited by - Ankhsy on 29 July 2006 4:49:15 PM |
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Alex Scarrow
Ape
969 Posts |
Posted - 31 July 2006 : 8:20:03 PM
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So far I'm choosing between Dros', Ank' and Parm' to place my vote. Some questions though:
Parm....15 years national service!? Are you mad? That's...that's brutal. So that runs from what?...16-31. That basically means no tax levied from a huge chunk of the workforce. And with an ageing national demographic requiring tax on the young to pay for all those pensions...that's a recipe for disaster.
Ank...what the hell were you smoking when you came up with that Pantheon stuff? Jeeeez, I mean...you get in to power, does that mean we've got to constantly keep an eye on you whilst you're in office in case you suddenly go strange on us?
Dros...(and Parm)...nationalizing our transport system? So in principle yeah...a good idea, but how do we avoid going back to the bad old days where there was no performance incentive. I mean to get an idea how crud our re-nationalized services would be, take a look at the CSA, the Home Office, DOE...rife with incompetence, staffed in the main by people who...to put it kindly...aren't really that motivated. And what about all those investors?
there you go...some feedback. I think I know now where my vote is currently going.
nb: feel free to trash each other's manifestos ;-)
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Parmenion
Homosapien
United Kingdom
13892 Posts |
Posted - 01 August 2006 : 09:54:27 AM
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No not each person doing 15 years, the obligatory national service will run for 15 years each person will serve 2 years, until that 15 years has expired at that point we may have turned a corner with society, we should then have instilled discipline in at least 1 possible 2 generations who can then pass these values on to theri kids
Ok with regard to nationalising we use proper professionals to run these companies, we dont give them jobs for life, wages are as per other companies, there are no special benefits, admin is kept to a min, we are out of the EU so we dont need to fill out all that BullSt paper work for them, we set our own rules and standards.
we set these companies up usuing corporate floaters directors who have experience of floeating companies on the FTSE they know how to strip things to the bones so they run lean and mean.
This way costs stay down, we have motivated staff, who like anyone in a FTSE company have the oportun ity of bonuses based on performance.
Bosses get realistic wage banded jobs, underperformers get managed out of the job if they cannot cut the mustard. the latest employment laws make this easy.
LASCIATE OGNE SPERANZA, VOI CH'INTRATE
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Ankhsy
Homosapien
United Kingdom
7087 Posts |
Posted - 01 August 2006 : 3:27:20 PM
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Pantheism, Alex....Pantheism.
Being a confirmed Atheist, I do not believe in god, so no chance of me going weird in that direction. However, I have to take into account those people who do believe in a 'divine' god force, almost all religions believing that that force is the creator of the Universe and is manifest in all aspects of it.
I do believe that as we are all part of the same Universe, we humans have an obligation to care for and respect the Universe in all its diversity (past, present and life forms still to be discovered).
Whether you respect nature because we are part of it and have an obligation to care for it because it is as special as we are, or whether it is because god is present in all aspects of nature and therefore needs to be respected, the results are the same - Pantheism - a respect for the universe in all its permutations (infinite diversity in infinite combination).
"It's hard to work in a group when you're omniscient."
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Alex Scarrow
Ape
969 Posts |
Posted - 01 August 2006 : 3:31:57 PM
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| Ooops. duh. That's the problem with forum posting and watching SpongeBob Squarepants at the same time. |
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Parmenion
Homosapien
United Kingdom
13892 Posts |
Posted - 01 August 2006 : 3:35:33 PM
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i watched sponge bob on holiday with my neices ...i could feel my IQ drop as the program went on...good fun though! {grin}
LASCIATE OGNE SPERANZA, VOI CH'INTRATE
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Ankhsy
Homosapien
United Kingdom
7087 Posts |
Posted - 01 August 2006 : 3:38:35 PM
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Who? Obviously out of my TV age range.
"It's hard to work in a group when you're omniscient."
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Parmenion
Homosapien
United Kingdom
13892 Posts |
Posted - 01 August 2006 : 4:08:12 PM
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its for age 5-10 i think?
LASCIATE OGNE SPERANZA, VOI CH'INTRATE
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John Prigent
Homosapien
United Kingdom
8413 Posts |
Posted - 01 August 2006 : 5:31:43 PM
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Is that physical age or mental age?
Cheers
John |
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drosdelnoch
Small mammal
United Kingdom
482 Posts |
Posted - 01 August 2006 : 7:30:42 PM
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Dros...(and Parm)...nationalizing our transport system? So in principle yeah...a good idea, but how do we avoid going back to the bad old days where there was no performance incentive. I mean to get an idea how crud our re-nationalized services would be, take a look at the CSA, the Home Office, DOE...rife with incompetence, staffed in the main by people who...to put it kindly...aren't really that motivated. And what about all those investors?
Its quite a simple piece of work really. With a descent transport system, we would aid the environment. Like the government there would be no dodgy deals under the table, no table fixing for bonuses due to additional rule 3. And it would not scrimp on materials like certain companies. Anyone found cheating the system would have to face rule 3. Dead easy, one way or the other, those who couldnt achieve the goals then well we get someone better. We would do away with a lot of red tape ie 25 forms just to get a loo roll so we cut down on admin, therefore the money saved on that area would go into getting the workers to do a descent job ie repairs and running the services.
One other thing that I'd like to add would be that all students would get the basic unemployment and benefits, ie housing and council tax. However they would be reviewed every semester, ie grades not good enough then youre booted and have to pay back what youve been given. Likewise the students wouldnt have to pay for the university fees, they would be done away with and everyone would have a fair shot at attending. As mentioned by other parties we would however do away with useless courses, after all if its not going to be worth the paper written on why let people waste thier time, government money (as it will be at that point) and we will hopefully bring up the average education level in the country.
Legends Never Die, Druss Lives! |
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John Prigent
Homosapien
United Kingdom
8413 Posts |
Posted - 01 August 2006 : 9:45:57 PM
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The problem with nationalised companies is that they tend to be run for the benefit of the staff. Everyone from top to bottom knows that they have an effective (if not absolute) monopoly and can simply push up the prices to pay higher wages, so the unions strike every year for more pay and the executives just pay themselves more. I've lived through the period of State-run utilities and, believe me, the current drive for profits to pay investors is nothing compared with the old days. At least you no longer have to wait three weeks to three months to get a phone line!
Dros, I'd like to see fees abolished too, but only for courses that genuinely _are_ work qualifications. I've worked with too many people who had degrees in nonsense subjects but had no common sense and no ability to write clear English or even to deal with people who telephoned with problems. And I do think that medical, dental and optical degrees should be fee-free but carry the responsibility to work for the NHS for a set period, say 10 years, to pay the taxpayer back for the free tuition. Though I don't see why full-time students should get unemployment or other benefits as well as free accomodation.
Cheers
John |
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Ankhsy
Homosapien
United Kingdom
7087 Posts |
Posted - 01 August 2006 : 10:22:00 PM
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I like John and Parm's hard-line. Unfortunately, I like the EU too...I'll have to think on that one. Free cookies...now, that really has got my attention.
This is a tough one.
"It's hard to work in a group when you're omniscient."
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Parmenion
Homosapien
United Kingdom
13892 Posts |
Posted - 02 August 2006 : 09:50:40 AM
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Ankhsy, Yes i take a hard line but its in the interest of everyone, and my manifesto is also very environmentaly based, its time we looked after our own and their future!
LASCIATE OGNE SPERANZA, VOI CH'INTRATE
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drosdelnoch
Small mammal
United Kingdom
482 Posts |
Posted - 02 August 2006 : 10:04:04 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by John Prigent
The problem with nationalised companies is that they tend to be run for the benefit of the staff. Everyone from top to bottom knows that they have an effective (if not absolute) monopoly and can simply push up the prices to pay higher wages, so the unions strike every year for more pay and the executives just pay themselves more. I've lived through the period of State-run utilities and, believe me, the current drive for profits to pay investors is nothing compared with the old days. At least you no longer have to wait three weeks to three months to get a phone line!
Dros, I'd like to see fees abolished too, but only for courses that genuinely _are_ work qualifications. I've worked with too many people who had degrees in nonsense subjects but had no common sense and no ability to write clear English or even to deal with people who telephoned with problems. And I do think that medical, dental and optical degrees should be fee-free but carry the responsibility to work for the NHS for a set period, say 10 years, to pay the taxpayer back for the free tuition. Though I don't see why full-time students should get unemployment or other benefits as well as free accomodation.
Cheers
John
With the reaquiring of the privatised companies into the government fold, it wouldnt be run for the big wigs but for the people. They like the government would be receiving a wage with no bonus.
As to the students, it would be the same as the basic unemployment,
1) The benefits would be the same, if they live at home then they wouldnt need housing or council tax, if they live away then yes, they would need the benefits. The fact that they are tested would mean that if they dropped out they would be out on thier ear having to pay back what was already given to them.
2) I already stated that only courses of use would be run, hence the saving on money from that field.
Anksy hence the parties opinion on the need to do away with government "back handers." as well as the reasoning behind how the government would be run.
Did I forget to mention that we're giving away a free box of cookies to our voters?
Legends Never Die, Druss Lives! |
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Parmenion
Homosapien
United Kingdom
13892 Posts |
Posted - 02 August 2006 : 10:15:24 AM
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I think we also need to scrap the use of external examiners in schools, once we have done away with all the EU paper work that wastes so much teaching time, they will have time to once again mark student papers, this will stop the cheating and also allow for accurate marking.
A complete reworking of the exam system is also in order the GCSE system is just wrong, the exams are too easy and our youth are being turned into idiots.
I hate to follow an example set by the USA but some kind of regular scoring system to monitor them all the way through school is required.
If a student fails a year we keep them back until they attain the level of knowledeg that moves them to the next year.
LASCIATE OGNE SPERANZA, VOI CH'INTRATE
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John Prigent
Homosapien
United Kingdom
8413 Posts |
Posted - 02 August 2006 : 12:30:32 PM
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Oh no, Parm, not marking by the teachers whose payrises depend on the students getting good marks. Can anyone really believe that the marking would be 100% honest in all cases?
Cheers
John |
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Parmenion
Homosapien
United Kingdom
13892 Posts |
Posted - 02 August 2006 : 12:57:13 PM
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no but we will be doing away with these eu directives, Schools will be taken back to a time when they wree effective, the teachers will have the power back, discipline will be reintroduced.
Teachers will have a wage, not perfomance related just a flat wage
LASCIATE OGNE SPERANZA, VOI CH'INTRATE
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Ankhsy
Homosapien
United Kingdom
7087 Posts |
Posted - 02 August 2006 : 2:32:15 PM
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Does reintroducing discipline and effective teaching in the classroom have anythinhg to do with the EU? I thought it was the Government that set curriculums.
What are your opinions on the news that schools are no longer to teach the difference between right and wrong?
"It's hard to work in a group when you're omniscient."
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John Prigent
Homosapien
United Kingdom
8413 Posts |
Posted - 02 August 2006 : 2:48:04 PM
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Utter horror! Though given the quality of education it is doubtful whether some teachers know the difference themselves.
Cheers
John |
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Parmenion
Homosapien
United Kingdom
13892 Posts |
Posted - 02 August 2006 : 3:08:00 PM
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The goverment sets policy but based on eu directives, its the directives on human rights and PC ness that have screwed up schools
LASCIATE OGNE SPERANZA, VOI CH'INTRATE
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drosdelnoch
Small mammal
United Kingdom
482 Posts |
Posted - 02 August 2006 : 4:06:31 PM
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So Parm, just out of curiosity, have you done Army time? Just that how can you think its a good thing if you havent experienced it yourself? (WRY SMILE)
Legends Never Die, Druss Lives! |
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Parmenion
Homosapien
United Kingdom
13892 Posts |
Posted - 02 August 2006 : 4:13:27 PM
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Dros
I have ben in the cubs, the scouts, the venture scounts the Air training corp, and i even ran for the army once (got roped into it) i have been on survival course and even a 2 week boot camp with the army.
I have had many friends in the army and seen how it straightened them out.
I have a fair idea of the benefits...dont get me wrong there are pitfalls but they are outweighted by the pitfalls most reprobates will suffer with the police etc wuithout this training.
LASCIATE OGNE SPERANZA, VOI CH'INTRATE
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John Prigent
Homosapien
United Kingdom
8413 Posts |
Posted - 02 August 2006 : 4:49:49 PM
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But as a former Regular who suffered from thieving National Servicemen I'm not so sure.
Cheers
John |
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Parmenion
Homosapien
United Kingdom
13892 Posts |
Posted - 02 August 2006 : 6:12:02 PM
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Ah but thats the view of rivalry between regulars and the conscripted national service men
I've heard about the rivalry, that sort of thing exists anywhere, you have to admit the training would really benefit the chavs that you see on the street these days?
LASCIATE OGNE SPERANZA, VOI CH'INTRATE
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John Prigent
Homosapien
United Kingdom
8413 Posts |
Posted - 02 August 2006 : 7:28:02 PM
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Sorry, Parm, you're too young to have been there. I saw no rivalry between Regulars and conscripts, quite the opposite. But the conscription process made no distinction between honest, decent types and petty criminals, and both Regulars and conscripts suffered from the scum element being thrust among us.
Cheers
John |
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drosdelnoch
Small mammal
United Kingdom
482 Posts |
Posted - 02 August 2006 : 9:45:26 PM
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I heard the opposite though John from my other halfs father who signed up 16. He was a Royal Signal so he had one of the cushier jobs after basic training. LOL Trouble was he was too innocent at the time (we are talking the 50's here) so we pretty much know how innocent some of them were.
Plus if it came in, it would ruin Bad Lads Army for the rest of us, for example that fat guy who got Trench Foot in the barracks. Mind you I can here the Chavs already "But Deez culers dont work wherez da Burberry."
Either the army would get wiped out or the enemy would be flat on thier backs laughing thier backsides off. Then again we would get rid of the chavs so it may not actually be that bad an idea. You know Parm, perhaps we could do it, except we have the chav units in burberry against the regular army. We all know who to send in first.
Legends Never Die, Druss Lives! |
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Parmenion
Homosapien
United Kingdom
13892 Posts |
Posted - 03 August 2006 : 08:59:56 AM
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I like that ...Ma-am this is the houshold cavalry...and this next unit, is the Burberry irregulars LOL!!
And john there will always be rivalry and there are plenty of crooks in the regular army, they ran enough black market stuff down the years.
And as an overall solution more would benefit than would lose out.
LASCIATE OGNE SPERANZA, VOI CH'INTRATE
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John Prigent
Homosapien
United Kingdom
8413 Posts |
Posted - 03 August 2006 : 10:12:01 AM
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Maybe we should ask Salve. But all I've heard from the high ranks is that the Army, Navy, Marines and Air Force don't want concripts - by the time they're any use they're due for discharge.
Cheers
John |
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Parmenion
Homosapien
United Kingdom
13892 Posts |
Posted - 03 August 2006 : 10:27:23 AM
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Nothing worthwhile is ever easy!"
LASCIATE OGNE SPERANZA, VOI CH'INTRATE
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Ankhsy
Homosapien
United Kingdom
7087 Posts |
Posted - 03 August 2006 : 10:32:14 AM
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Manifestos...discuss
